THE QUEST FOR THE LOWER SEAT

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alerno
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THE QUEST FOR THE LOWER SEAT

Post by alerno » Tue Mar 17, 2015 12:20 am

Hi,

I am new and I am aware there have already been forae with discussions about the seating height. I want to synthesise, summarise what we know and please add (or correct) if you know more/better:


Preamble

The seating position in the Pumas is agreed, not unanimously but still by a majority, to be a tad too high. Not only reviewers from car magazines of its day or used car reviewers now but also various users of this very club have expressed their (moderate) discontent with the seating position. It is more than understandable, since our little gems are based on a humble 1980's Fiesta platform, which is what makes them great in the first place, as they are light, inexpensive, basic, easy to maintain. But seating position reflects design intention of the origins and is not quite perfect as standard. This forum would like to perfect this as much as possible.


Summary by type:

- Pre-99 standard seats (T-shape handle on top, electric adjustment for driver) mostly deemed high (I agree)

- Pre-99 Recaros (same cloth as standard, electric adjustment, only available in continental Europe) just as high -although comfort and lateral support are great-

- Post-99 standard (round handle at the corner of seat, manual-only adjustment) deemed slightly lower but with more leg room (cloth, half-leather, full-leather) however, lateral support is not great. Post-99 cars have a different floorpan and hence runners are different

- Post-99 Recaros (the same as pre-99 but with new runners, and leather-only) Seat height compared to others?

- FRP seats, Sparco Torinos, (rare, expensive) Deemed very low but also least comfortable.

- Escort V Recaros, some claim (who? details?) the seats lie lower and only need adapted runners for post-99 floorpan. I measured the same height as post-99 Recaros.

- Capri Recaros, some claim (who? details?) the seats lie lowest with new runners.

- Escort IV Recaros

- Escort VI Recaros

- Fiesta III Recaros

- Fiesta IV Zetec S Recaros

- Fiesta V ST

- Fiesta VI ST

- Focus I

- Focus II

- Other seats?
Last edited by alerno on Tue Mar 17, 2015 12:58 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: THE QUEST FOR THE LOWER SEAT

Post by alexwilliams840 » Tue Mar 17, 2015 12:34 am

How tall are you?

I'm a little over 6'4 and I have standard leathers. I find if it's fully lowered and tilted back even a little bit there is enough room. Never wanted to be gripped in the seat more either but for track driving you may
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Re: THE QUEST FOR THE LOWER SEAT

Post by alerno » Tue Mar 17, 2015 1:03 am

I'm 1.80 metres tall. My head doesn't touch the roof. But since little Pumitas are (in my opinion) close to perfection in almost every aspect you can think of (light, nimble, nippy, direct, analog, neutral, frugal, understated, look fantastic, etc, etc.) I would like to hone the best possible attainable position.

My current post-99 leather Recaros are marvellous in themselves... but those couple of centimetres too high.
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Re: THE QUEST FOR THE LOWER SEAT

Post by PumaJay » Tue Mar 17, 2015 8:12 am

Im only 3cm taller than you and I've never thought the standard seats we're too high.

I used to have mine as low as it would go, with it right back on the runner and I used to fit nicely into my old puma.

Your only real option is fit an aftermarket seat on a custom subframe and runner to get a seat that would be a lot lower.
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Re: THE QUEST FOR THE LOWER SEAT

Post by TGPlayer1 » Tue Mar 17, 2015 11:21 am

You could go for a custom job like i did, scroll down a bit until you get to the pictures

http://www.projectpuma.com/viewtopic.ph ... 37#p332937" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: THE QUEST FOR THE LOWER SEAT

Post by Wild E. Coyote » Tue Mar 17, 2015 4:25 pm

alerno wrote:Hi,
- FRP seats, Sparco Torinos, (rare, expensive) Deemed very low but also least comfortable.
Just to add my two pennies here. I had recaros in my car and they are comfy OK. If covered in leather, though, they don't hold you at all as you are sliding in them all the time.

Now have sparcos and can tell you they are not uncomfortable at all, it is just getting into them is an exercise in itself, but that is why they hold you so nicely in corners.

And they are just as high or as low as recaros. But again, their runners are very easy to reproduce at lower height if needed
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Re: THE QUEST FOR THE LOWER SEAT

Post by alerno » Wed Mar 18, 2015 2:24 am

Wild E. Coyote wrote:
alerno wrote:Hi,
- FRP seats, Sparco Torinos, (rare, expensive) Deemed very low but also least comfortable.
Just to add my two pennies here. I had recaros in my car and they are comfy OK. If covered in leather, though, they don't hold you at all as you are sliding in them all the time.

Now have sparcos and can tell you they are not uncomfortable at all, it is just getting into them is an exercise in itself, but that is why they hold you so nicely in corners.

And they are just as high or as low as recaros. But again, their runners are very easy to reproduce at lower height if needed
Thanks for the reply.

Are you the Croatian guy who bought his car right here in Bonn?

Please tell me more: Firstly, do you have Sparco Torinos (these aren't full buckets) or a different type?

Is your car Pre-99 or Post-99?

So you reckon they are as high (not lower) than the Recaros?

With uncomfortable I only mean "harder"... So if you have back issues like me... But if you reckon they're the same...
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Re: THE QUEST FOR THE LOWER SEAT

Post by Wild E. Coyote » Wed Mar 18, 2015 6:30 am

alerno wrote:
Wild E. Coyote wrote:
alerno wrote:Hi,
- FRP seats, Sparco Torinos, (rare, expensive) Deemed very low but also least comfortable.
Just to add my two pennies here. I had recaros in my car and they are comfy OK. If covered in leather, though, they don't hold you at all as you are sliding in them all the time.

Now have sparcos and can tell you they are not uncomfortable at all, it is just getting into them is an exercise in itself, but that is why they hold you so nicely in corners.

And they are just as high or as low as recaros. But again, their runners are very easy to reproduce at lower height if needed
Thanks for the reply.

Are you the Croatian guy who bought his car right here in Bonn?

Please tell me more: Firstly, do you have Sparco Torinos (these aren't full buckets) or a different type?

Is your car Pre-99 or Post-99?

So you reckon they are as high (not lower) than the Recaros?

With uncomfortable I only mean "harder"... So if you have back issues like me... But if you reckon they're the same...
Yes, I am. Ich habe meinen Wagen in Bonn gekauft; es ist Puma Futura mit Recaro Ledersietzen.

Jetzt im Wagen sind Sparco Torino aus Ford RallyKa.

Mein Puma Futura ist aus 2001.

Uf, my German is letting me down now as I am not using it enough. :oops:

The seating position of sparcos is pretty much the same as with recaros (give or take milimeter here and there) but as said earlier, the base of the runners is VERY easy to be reproduced and you can make the sitting possition lower by few centimeters for sure. Have a look through my thread, you will see that the base that bolts on the floorpan is very simple construction
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THE QUEST FOR THE LOWER SEAT

Post by Orphan » Wed Aug 14, 2019 4:39 pm

Have anyone tried to adapt a RX-8 seat on a Puma?
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THE QUEST FOR THE LOWER SEAT

Post by Pkp » Sun Aug 18, 2019 10:04 pm

Not tried an Rx-8 seat, but when I had my Thunder with the original leather seats I also found them too high.

I did have a pair of Recaros (From Recaro, not out of another car) that I had fitted to two different Sierra 4x4s, and a '98 V6 Mondeo, so fitted those. With the Sierra, they had adaptors to fit to the Sierra Runners, and for the Mondeo, a complete set of runners from Recaro that had two selectable (ie not adjustable) height settings. Purchased Recaro runners for Fiesta/Puma, and after a minor mod for the pre-tensioners fitted them to the Puma. These seating solutions were not cheap but if you do a lot of miles, they are comfortable and supportive.(About £900 in 1989 for the Sierra two seats and adaptors +£300 for Mondeo adaptors, and £300 for the Fiesta/Puma Adaptors but my bum probably did about 200k miles in total on them !)

Previous to that, in three Capris (2.0S and 2x2.8s) I had Recaros, so my rear is Recaro shaped!
The first post in this thread refers to Capri Recaro seats on new runners as being a suitable low height. The fittings on the underside of a Capri Recaro are identical to those on a "Recaro" Recaro so I can concur with this statement.

Although the Thunder has gone, (gloom) I still have two cars with factory Recaros and regard them as the best thing I did to the the Sierras, Mondeo and Puma. The seats are still in the garage, just in case!

And to quote my Sister in law, when my brother sold his Cosworth and replaced it with a Jag XJ Sport. "The Jag's nice, but it has not got Recaros!

And no, I do not work for Recaro.

What a boring post!
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THE QUEST FOR THE LOWER SEAT

Post by Orphan » Sun Aug 18, 2019 10:16 pm

I'm looking for a cheaper solution, in case the Puma seats are not low enough for me (I didn't have the opportunity to seat on one yet), as i'm 6′4″.

I have also concerns about the feet room, because i wear size 15 sport shoes, and found than a lot of cars are designed for people with ballerina feet. :-P :-P :-P
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THE QUEST FOR THE LOWER SEAT

Post by alerno » Sun Aug 18, 2019 11:14 pm

In the end I never fitted the Recaros i bought from a last-gen Escort (not Cossie, perhaps XR3i, can't remember) because I measured the height and it seemed the exact same as my leather Puma-OEM Recaros. In the end the OEM Recaros are high, the kidney support gets destroyed very soon (the outer part is thin synthetic leather) but I wouldn't say they are bad. The main reason for me was that I have back pains and this seat for some reason never gives me the pains all other car seats give me.

I also seem to remember somebody said not even the SportsKa Sparcos were that much lower.
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THE QUEST FOR THE LOWER SEAT

Post by Pkp » Mon Aug 19, 2019 12:59 pm

The Thunder Leathers certainly upset my back, but as I already had the Recaros, my solution was cost effective. I actually bought the seats in 1989, and only ever replaced the rubber sheet under the seat cushion. As they are not handed, I could swap them from OS to NS to equalise any wear over the 27 years that they were in my cars.
recaro.jpg
Grey Recaro...
As someone who used to do an awful lot of miles, I think seats are under rated. Support and a driving position that enable you to drive for over three hours, then get back in for another three hours then still walk (!) is pretty important, that's why I bought them!
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