Budget Puma TURBO Project!!

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Yeah, if the system works for me, it will work for you. I brought an Eaton M45 from a mini to put on mine, that was the 1st option, as a supercharger is better then a turbo in my opinion, as there is no lag, and as you can use the 4-2-1 manifold, the air flowing through the engine is better, so the boost created will create more power, its just that the only place i could find to mount it, was to replace the A/C compressor, and didnt really want to loose that, also, the only way i could regulate the boost was changing the pulley size. I think it really depends what kind of power your going for, if you get an FMU, that should sort the fuelling out, and if you keep the standard map on your ecu, the ignition timing is slightly retarded, so your less likely to get detonation, its up to you if you want to lower the compression or not, you dont necciserily have to, as you do loose a bit of power doing so, but its safer. Also, the way a supercharger works, you dont need an intercooler, although again, you can run more boost if you do.
 
You also need to look at what choice of charger you want, the eaton m45 maxes out at 10psi (about 0.7 bar) at about 14000rpm iirc. Depending how much boost you wanted, youd have to look at it like this:
1400 = 1psi
2800 = 2psi
4200 = 3psi
5600 = 4psi
7000 = 5psi
8400 = 6psi
9800 = 7psi
11200 = 8psi
12600 = 9psi
14000 = 10psi

so if you want to go for 8psi, you need to look at your car and the max revs you want to go with a S/C is about 6500, so i think your crank size is 130mm (could be wrong) so in order to get 8psi at 6500rpm, youd need a pulley size of 75.44mm, or about 75mm would be close enough! But the standard pulley is 70mm, so you can see how it can be tricky, unless you you can get a custom pulley made up?

There are bypass valves available, but they are only abailable for certain models, and arent cheap!

If you want to go aftermarket management, you can go with either Omex or Emerald, both of these are capable of running the VCT effectively.
 
Think i heard once omex is on an ecu it can never be overwritten with any other map. please bare this in mind :)
 
Thanks for all the info - as far as i could see Omex wouldn't support VCT, which model does? Omex would be preferred as my Brothers Dad is very well experienced in mapping race cars using Omex managament. Not to mention he suggested that mapping for S/C's is much easier as its a more linear power delivery as opposed to Turbos with varying boost levels/RPMs etc. The power we are aiming to achieve on all standard bits is something like 170-190bhp which would make the Puma very hard to catch. We also are thinking of using an Eaton M45 or the charger from a Golf G60 as we know someone who deals in performance VW parts. I can do without A/C for the sake of a S/C so that shouldn't be too much of a problem!
 
what did you do with the m45 eaton pumanoob! still got it? do you like aircon that much!
 
Just been speaking with Omex regarding engine management and they very kindly sent me all this :)

Hi James

The 600 ECU has the ability to control ON / OFF cam controls, where as for continuously variable cams, the 710 is required. Quite often, on continuously variable systems, especially those that do not move the cams through very great angles, it is perfectly acceptable to just move them with ON/OFF controls. Attached is a magazine article about fitting an Omex 600 to one of these engines. Sorry for the attachments being so large but it’s the only way you can still read the print!

Quite often such large attachments just bounce so I will send this email again without the attachments.


Best regards


Andy Cornock
Omex Technology


He also sent me some magazine images of a kit car being made up with Omex 600 management. They found out that from 1500RPM to 5100RPM that the engine performed better however after 5100RPM it performed better without so set the ECU to switch VCT off at that point up to the limiter at 7500RPM. Very interesting indeed :)
 
Thats spot on then mate, but how much do you think youll get the ECU, installation, and mapping? Ideally thats what i wanted, but the cost just seemed too much! And yeah, that is very interesting, was that done on a kit car with a 1.7 zetec, or a different vct engine? also not sure if your aware, but the puma only had 1 variable cam, the inlet cam. Any technical info you can get like that mate, id be very greatful if you could keep sharing!! And yeah, it is easier to map a S/C, because the power and torque curve is relevant to the standard power and torque, and the power feeds gradually in, so you could use TPS or MAP sensor to tune it, where as you get the kick or a turbo at around 2000rpm (depending on compressor housing size)

Djsounds02, youcan overwrite an omex system as many times as you like, as most people have them fitted, and install a base map to get the car running, then live map it on a rolling rd, so they can get the best out of what they have, then at a later date, you can change it again if you change the set up of your car, it would be foolish to make an ecu that can have 1 map burned to it, then not be able to make adjustments or change the map on it!! Yeah, still got the S/C, might put it on my next project, whatever it may be!!
 
Got my head back today, so on with the building!!
PICT0037.jpg


Not the best quality pics, but you can see how nice and shiny these inlet ports are!!
PICT0038.jpg


And here is a pic of that guys engine who supercharged the 1.6, just for reference of where he put it, but if your going into a puma, its VERY tight, you will need a slimline fan as it wont fit with the standard 1!!
Supercharged16.jpg
 
Lol, nah mate, im not selling the supercharger, ill do my turbo, and if everything works out, i might swap it for the S/c set up to get a better power curve! I have all the bits to do it, would just need custom inlet and outlet ports and mountings for the charger
 
whats the box over the inlet for? is it custom as ive seen a couple of these boxes what are they off any ideas?

custom inlet and outlet ports?
 
Its a charge cooler, i think that 1 is off a supercharged jag, and been modified and fitted to an inlet flange of the zetec engine. It is plumbed into water or air, and cools the air that goes into the inlet.
 
I'm sure i made a post here but it's dissapeared!

I think the management itself is going to be expensive however the mapping wont cost much if at all - i'm not going to ask for it to be done for free as thats rude but if he will then bonus!

Just remember the setup is slightly different on that because the engine was mounted for RWD. And yes i believe that is indeed water cooling for the charge. I have the intercooler from a Delta Integrale which is quite small in size so i will likely be using that if it isn't too much effort to fit!

A charger will be less harsh than a turbo and means i get to keep my 4-2-1 mani which is a big plus!
 
Im loving the idea of a decent turbo'd puma, ive got Rotrex Supercharger currently in progress at the moment ive removed my a/c, which aids cooling of this engine amazing as the a/c rad isn't in the way so the engine is hardly breaking a sweat lately! Im fitting a MF2 fifth injector as its the simpliest & cost effective way to setup the install. The mf2 won't have any problems running the smooth curve of a supercharger plus if i need to remove the system i can do so without any problems the car will just run the current ecu map. Where did you get the decompression plates from?? as i may go down this route??
 
Yes, ive followed your supercharger thread from the beggining, didnt you hook it up already with makeshift brackets, and it whent like s**t off a shovel?? Supercharging is the best option all the way, but i really wanted to see how the standard engine would cope with the boost 1st, and the turbo was just easier at the time, i had planned on supercharging, but took the easy route in the end.
If you email Craig at Lasermaster at [email protected], and tell him Erroll gave you him email address, he will sort you out with the decompression plates, i think he charges £40 plus postage, which i think is very reasonable for a stainless steel plate, he will also do you an aluminium 1 if you want, but i went for stainless for strength. My plate is 2mm, which with 2 head gaskets, lowers the compression to 8.5:1, which seems about the average for supercharged/turbo cars. If you want to lower it any more or less then that, he can work it out for you, youll just need the bore width (80mm),the stroke (83.5mm), and the total volume of each cylinder including the combustion chamber (464.8844cc) (the cylinder volume on its own is 419.75cc),or ill do it, just tell me what compression ratio you'd like, and ill calculate it for you. This is only for the 1.7, but i can do any engine. If you want a decompression plate for a different engine, youll have to send him a head gasket from your engine to get the pattern from.
 
Awesome thats good news & a reasonable price too! Yeah i proper makeshifted it me & my mechanic friend were bored only for a few runs! Ive took it off since just to get it properly setup with a solid bracket etc! Where you get your head gaskets from?? because there not cheap for two unless you can buy them individually??
 
Yeah, i had exactly the same thing, and for a project like this, you cant use cheap cornflake packet gaskets off ebay! I have a mate doing a mechanics apprenticeship, and he got me 2 gaskets from ford for £55, which is really good, but i emailed a few places, and believe it or not, ford were the cheapest, even without my mates discount, and youd expect the gaskets to be decent quality from them too!
 
Heres the stainless steel skin fitting ive used for my oil return to the sump
Oil_Return2.jpg

Heres the oil return and one of my shawspeed conrod bolts.
Rod_bolt1.jpg

And this is the engine fitted, with the sump off and the rod bolts replaced
Sump_off2.jpg


Ok, as you can see, ive spent the last few days building the engine, and fitting it. Its all fitted. Next step is to bend some custom pipes, and move the radiator back, and fit this intercooler
Intercooler.jpg

Its got a large surface area, but its really thin, and has thin cores, so it dosent have a large internal volume (larger volumes mean more lag), but the larger surface area means more cooling!
 
Very nice :) I wish i had the money to get started on the 'charger! The intercooler from the Integrale is the opposite - It's only about 25-30cm wide but about 3-4inches deep.
 

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