Help! - input camshaft out of position after setting

[SimonhSmith]

Hi all,

I have just changed the cambelt, tensioner on my Puma, This is the 2nd Puma I have done in past 6 months using the guide on here and the gates bulletin 036 for setting the tensioner. I have access to a workshop with powered lift which makes the job a lot easier.
The first Puma that was done went fine, in particular after setting up the camshaft timing using the setting tool, and rotating the engine 2 revolutions, everything stayed in line (i.e. setting bar went back in).
However, with this car, after the engine is rotated the input camshaft is always lagging considerably as per photos - about 10 Deg out. The belt and tensioner are definitely correctly fitted and have followed the guide to the letter. After setting the cams with the setting bar and tightening to torque, when the engine is rotated by hand the exhaust cam rotates correctly but the input cam does not initially turn. It is something to do with the VCT unit. With everything torqued up and using a spanner on the camshaft I can move the cam about 20 degrees which I assume is the range of the VCT adjustment. I have tried taking out the 'play' before setting the cam but it always ends up out of position by roughly the same amount.
Interestingly, I checked the cam timing before starting and the input shaft was lagging then, although I would say by about 5 degrees rather than the 10 I have now.

Any ideas?

 

[SimonhSmith]

Aha....
Found and watched the 'how the Ti-VCT system works' video, the fact I can move the cam says the locking pin isn't engaged. Now just need to strip the mechanism which from the video doesn't look too difficult, will have a bash (I mean careful investigation) today. If anyone's come across this before would appreciate any input, thanks!

 

[DOH]

Simon I had the same problem when I recently changed my cam belt.

Before dismantling , I checked how everything aligned up and despite the last cam belt being done in Fords Dealership the inlet cam was out by 5 to degrees.
After a lot of head scratching I deduced that Fords had used the incorrect crank locking pin , as there are 3 in the kit .
Ensure you are using the 38mm length pin ( there is mention of this on this site)

The one area of ambiguity from both the guide on here and also the Gates 036 bulletin is the fact there is no mention anywhere on the clearance between the kickback plate and tensioner pulley after pulling the pin out form the initial stage to tension the belt with all the pulleys have been loosened.

I had correctly used the bar across the camshafts, correct 38mm crank locking pin pulled the tensioner pin out the initial specified amount, with the cam pulleys loosened and after the 2 revolutions turning clockwise mine was about 1-2 mm out on the inlet cam.
So I couldn't get the bar across the cams in again.
What I also found odd is that then pulling the pulley out completely didn't make any difference as by then there was no longer any spring tensioner pressure on it.

I incorrectly thought that because that inlet cam moves by oil pressure and that movement is referenced by the cam sensor feeding back to the ECU, that it would adjust itself after starting the engine.
Sadly the amount it was out of 1-2mm , although it made no difference to how the car drove threw up a cam sensor error when I checked it with my OBD reader after taking the car for a drive, resulting in me stripping the whole lot down again.

I resolved by ensuring I had 3-4 mm clearance between the tensioner and the tensioner pulley and then loosening up the inlet cam E11 bolt with a hole , re-tightened to approx half the specified torque , rotated the crank twice using the bottom pulley bolt and reinserted the crank locking pin and checked that the cam alignment bar now fitted , which it did. I then re-torqued up the inlet E11( a good fitting 9/16" socket also fits ok) bolt to the specified torque.

There was no need to strip the VCT unit.

Now that my cars cam timing is spot on, the car performs better and is also better on fuel.

If you carry out my advice you will be impressed with the performance increase. :thumbs:

 

[SimonhSmith]

Hi,

Thanks for the reply.
It is sorted now but was a different fix. I am sure the tensioner is adjusted ok - checked it after part removing the pin and was correctly positioned prior to torquing lower bolt.
I removed the inlet sprocket and checked over the VCT system - it is very different to the Ti-VCT system in the video. The Puma one has no locking pin and looks like it just uses oil pressure to advance with a spring return. Checked everything over and seemed ok, only thing I couln't really understand was a groove on the OD of the
spigot (see pic) but was deliberate not a score mark. I reassembled the sprocket onto the cam, part torqued and checked the action - can rotate sprocket easily by hand anticlockwise and snaps back under spring pressure, although I was surprised the spring action wasn't stronger. Nowhere near enough to overcome the valve spring pressure, though with the engine running it must retard when no valves are open. Slackened everything off, redid the timing and hey presto, everything aligned perfectly. I can only assume that the VCT wasn't returning properly before and I was effectively setting it partially advanced, although the action of torquing up the sprocket securing bolt I would have thought would not let this happen.
Whatever is ok now.
The only thing this does make me think is to check that the cam advance / retard is working with the engine running.

 

[DOH]

Hi Simon
Good to hear you've made progress, agreed I suspect the VCT doesn't automatically return fully especially as it is no longer a new part, when a friend did his a few years back the VCT pulley had seized up altogether!
The next time mine comes apart I will blow through all the holes in the VCT with compressed air, perhaps that will help it return as if there is a partial restriction due to a build up of oil residue.
I have heard talk on here that if you don't use 5w30 oil that the operation of that can be affected. There is no knowing what a previous owner has used when topping up the oil.

After having my engine apart twice my hands were sore form undoing the bolts to do the job with very little access.
It's worth getting the cam timing correct as it makes a noticeable difference.
If you haven't already, check the resistance values with a digital voltmeter on the K ohms scale . They should be between 5 -8 K ohms . (The lower the better). I have noticed with these engines that because of the high output from the coil pack , that the engine may appear to idle perfectly yet you may have some plug leads with high resistance.
they can also get damaged removing from the spark plugs.

Also if you have the earlier coilpack , set the plugs to a gap of 1.3mm as it will make the car more driveable with better low down torque. :thumbs: