Been asked MANY times before, OBD2 connection

[Bobby4Puma]

Ok...my damn car is officially posesed...last time the obd2 tool got connected while i was driving...now it doesnt wanna connect to the ecu at all...i tried all kinds of methods it just doesnt connect...i checked the odb2 tools i have on a vauxhall vectra 56 plate...was instant...i wonder why it connected last time but now it fails what voodoo do i need to do?

 

[Stevecvo]

Most of the cheap Autel scanners on Ebay are Chinese copies but they should work. I had a genuine Autel 319 and it connected fine with my 1999 Puma. After it broke I bought a genuine Autel AL 519 and although this works well I actually preferred the old 319. If your scanner works on other cars but not on the Puma this would obviously point to a problem with the OBD socket or its connections.

 

[Bobby4Puma]

Its weird cause at first i bought a bluetooth one that didnt work....then i bought another one that didnt work..then the Autel....didnt work at first but when i started driving connected some how....but since then it didnt connect no matter how i tried...engine off, engine on , ignition on...then i tested both on a vectra and they worked super fast i have no idea how can i fix this....also when the connected the obd tool at a garage...a professional one connected very fast its beyond my understanding...i also tried to move it slowly when i hooked it up...maybe the contact was loose...but....nothing

 

[tuonokid]

Maybe the carpet flap is pushing the plug off it's socket but Franks advice of clean and wiggle won't harm.
Barry

 

[Bobby4Puma]

Tnx Barry....thats what i did...maybe i didnt express myself right...i tried to wiggle it slowly maybe was a loose contact on a different matter of fact i ordered from Ian G the valve and a fuel pump tnx for the advice

 

[tuonokid]

Good man, I hope it all works out for you.
Barry

 

[Bobby4Puma]

Some will some wont...as u can see ) cheers

 

[JAC]

I ended up buying the USB version, as I tried 2 different Bluetooth ones and neither could connect to the Puma.

I have only briefly tried the USB one with a laptop and Forscan to make sure it works (I only just got the car back) but I have ordered a USB hub for my phone as Torque pro accepts USB. Supposedly the hub will allow connection and charging at the same time (but that could be pnly on my model of phone) but I will let you know definately when the hub arrives.

I am going to remount the ODB Port vertically (as mentioned above) and leave it connected to the hub behind the radio, so whenever I plug my phone in to charge, it will auto.atically connect to the ODB also.

 

[Frank]

I am going to remount the ODB Port vertically (as mentioned above) and leave it connected to the hub behind the radio, so whenever I plug my phone in to charge, it will automatically connect to the ODB also.

I suggest you do a parasitic draw test* before doing the final re-route, as there seems to be a division of opinion on the Net as to whether a permanently connected OBD is a parasitic drain or not.

I haven't needed to do the test for OBD, but I have done them for other stuff, so let me know if you need me to run through it. (it'll be on YouToob as well anyway)

* also sometimes called a 'parasitic drain test'.

 

[JAC]

Thanks Frank, I will do a test before I install it permanently. For now, I am sitll using a laptop and Forscan until such time as the car is healthy again. I will probably do it at the same time that I change the stereo etc. so I will do all wiring and testing at the same time.

I can't vouch for the Puma yet, but I haven't had issues with ODB drawing current on other cars in the past (except on a Citroen). They were Bluetooth adapters and not USB, but as long as the power is cut to the ODB socket when the ignitian is off, it shouldn't make any difference.

I will report back when I have tested.

 

[red]

Surely the hardware in Bluetooth or USB cable models to interface with the actual socket would be the same. Bluetooth/USB are just the methods that your device communicates to the adapter.

I think the cheap ones are just hit and miss personally.

 

[JAC]

One would think so, but I gave up after trying 2 and went for the USB which worked first time, probably pure coincidence, or maybe all the USB versions were made by the same guy in his garage and he had a large box full of the same parts

I plan on trying whatever Bluetooth versions friends and people I meet have, and if one works, then I will swap a new unopened one for it.

 

[red]

Chinese clones of chips I think is the problem half the time.

 

[Frank]

They were Bluetooth adapters and not USB, but as long as the power is cut to the ODB socket when the ignitian is off, it shouldn't make any difference.

But was the power cut? Those RS232 connectors have a lot of pins on them.

I tell you why I say that, and this is academic as both of us are on USB, if the power is really cut then why are there theoretical security risks using Bluetooth - https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=obd+bluetooth+security&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:unofficial&client=seamonkey-a&gws_rd=cr&ei=1w5wVtbEDIPiU5-St_gM" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

#1. Bluetooth was never originally designed for non-human handshakes (pairing) This trend of easy pairing on Bluetooth dongle stuff does carry the risk that anyone can pair with it.

#2. Point is, and this is the relevant part to us, if the power is truly off when the ignition was off then how could any hacker access the ECU via Bluetooth?

Personally, I think the risk is exaggerated and any drain minimal. But I think you see now why I suggested a parasitic draw test? My USB is not perm. connected, but I'd be interested to know if you find a drain on USB with ignition off or not.

Frank

 

[JAC]

I will let you know, but it may well be after Christmas by the time I get around to it.

(BTW, just as a quick test, when the ignition is off, my phone can no longer see the Bluetooth dongle).

EDIT: I tried again with my other bluetooth dongle, and it is still powered up and available even if the engine is off, so obviously it still does get power. I am thinking that an easy fix for this would be to add a switch to the core on pin 16 (which should be +12v unless I am mistaken), a more professional fix would be to add a relay to the core on pin 16, which is controlled by the ignition, so power would automatically be present when the ignition is on, but would cut it as soon as you turn it off (with a relay bypass switch if we really want to get fancy).

 

[PaulQ]

For what it's worth the ELM 237 (http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B0194Z7Q80?psc=1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false in my Puma has been on for the past year. It hasn't drained the battery and nobody has come along and retuned the car. I note that when the engine isn't going there is no data being transmitted.

 

[Frank]

EDIT: I tried again with my other bluetooth dongle, and it is still powered up and available even if the engine is off, so obviously it still does get power.

Thanks, that's interesting. I think given the low risk level then the simplest fix would be just to run a male/female RS232 lead from the OBD connector to the centre console (doing a neat job, like YOG did) and leave it at that.

You then connect either USB/Bluetooth reader to that and just disconnect it there only if the car is off the road for more than a week or so, or maybe if you're parked up in the centre of Madrid or something. Btw the normal resident draw on cars like Pumas is < 50mA.

.. and nobody has come along and retuned the car.

They are car thieves, not geeky mechanics trying to give you more bhp. Being able to access a car's ECU by any method means it's possible to override the security, open the doors and start the engine and away. Alternatively, it would be possible just to maliciously fry the entire ECU (which is only a computer, like any other) by just standing near a vehicle, in the case of Bluetooth.

A risk to very high-priced, luxury cars maybe, but not to our Pumas, I reckon.

 

[JAC]

You mean a Puma is not a high priced luxury vehicle

 

[mihalyn90]

Of course it is

I have a 98 puma... still uses OBD2? or something else?

Thanks

 

[Frank]

I have a 98 puma... still uses OBD2? or something else?

Well my '97 uses it.

But the last time I spent my free time trying to help someone on this stuff I got a mouthful of ill-tempered abuse for my trouble, so now my line is that I know nothing about this subject and people should take their cars to a garage for advice on this. :|