Intermittent Noise

[kaylins]

It's been a few months and still getting nowhere with the noise. I've lost count how many times she's been in and out of the garage and even the mechanics are baffled as to what is actually causing the problem.

So here's what's been done so far...

Failed MOT last month due to rust and questionable previous welding work (previous owner). So a lot of money was spent getting rust work done and welding done properly.

For the suspected ABS issue, they've ran tests and no fault it showing up at all. The contacts have been replaced as they were bulging, managed to drive about for a good month until the noise happened again. Then they replaced the hubs - drove around for a week and the noise happened again, this time much quieter than usual but still enough to be a nuisance. Went back in last week and the sensors eventually got replaced (after asking for this to be done first of all because of all that's been said on here). One of the mechanics even took her out for the best part of an hour and said she drove perfectly with no noise. Literally the following day (last Saturday) I drove out to visit family about 15miles away - nothing the whole drive, me thinking perfect we've actually cracked it! Until not even 10 minutes into the drive back home she did it again

Now she's back in the garage and has been since Monday, the guys at the garage haven't been able to make her make the noise once the whole week they've had her. One of the guys who has been so helpful throughout has taken her home for the weekend to drive her around to try and figure out what's causing the noise still. He has suggested there's a possibility it could be the circuit board in the ABS pump that could be tripping it out so the next thing they're going to try is sending it off to a specialist where they refurbish pumps.

They don't believe it's the pump itself because otherwise it would be making the noise all the time rather than intermittently and it would also show up on their computer tests as faulty. Other than this last thing, any one else have any other ideas? I've spent as much money trying to sort her out as I have on buying the car itself.

I really want to perservere with her as the amount of money I've already spent seems like such a waste and she's near perfect apart from that noise :-(

Oh also to add to this, it only ever did it at 30mph or less, now it's been happening at 40mph (don't know if that helps but thought I'd mention it)

 

[kaylins]

Update:

Got the car back last Thursday - Guys at the garage couldn't get her to make the noise once the whole time they had her and didn't want to send the pump off as they believe it would cost more than the car is worth to get repaired. Instead they cleaned the sensors and all of the contacts and didn't charge us anything this time around, which was nice of them considering how much has already been spent trying to solve the issue.

Not even 10 minutes of having the car back, she made the noise as my partner was driving to pick me up from work. This time however both the ABS and Traction control lights were on as he was parked up waiting for me. After driving off, the lights went off after about 5-10 seconds and was fine on the drive back home (which is only about 5 mins). The noise has occurred every time we've been out in her since and have noticed both ABS and Traction control lights come on intermittently if left idle on an uneven road for a few minutes but then disappears as soon as moving off onto a flat surface - The lights never came on before (only when you first turn on the ignition) it seems to be worse now than it was before and the only way I'm dealing with it at the moment is just having my music on loud so I can't hear it.

My partner has ordered the OBD reader that was recommended and just waiting for it to arrive but the whole thing is quite literally driving me mad!

 

[red]

That does sound all rather frustrating, if the light is coming on you'd have thought that the fault would be identifiable. I do hope that the read flags up a code!

 

[kaylins]

[post]352636[/post] That does sound all rather frustrating, if the light is coming on you'd have thought that the fault would be identifiable. I do hope that the read flags up a code!

It is! What makes it worse is I've got my driving test in 3 weeks which I've put off for long enough because of this issue.

I'm hoping it flags up with something as well. Even after all of this though it has not put me off of the car, she drives amazingly well which is why I've been so persistent but there's only so much I can justify doing and spending before I bite the bullet.

 

[Ian G]

Testing / refurbing the pump is indeed expensive and entirely unnecessary when a known-good used pump is £50.

Examine wheel speed live data, sensor outputs should also be tested with an oscilloscope, first things first lets see that you have a nice clean set of waves before you start worrying about replacing a pump that actually appears to just be responding correctly to erroneous sensor inputs.

 

[moondustka]

What about the ABS tone rings.. I read that the sensors have been replaced but obviously there's two parts here. It could be a dodgey tone ring and the front ones are relatively exposed and so maybe slightly damaged. Either that or too rusty!

 

[kaylins]

[post]352678[/post] What about the ABS tone rings.. I read that the sensors have been replaced but obviously there's two parts here. It could be a dodgey tone ring and the front ones are relatively exposed and so maybe slightly damaged. Either that or too rusty!

I believe only the back sensors and rings have been replaced. I have a very strong feeling it's the front nearside as the car has definitely had a big knock (previous owner) and could have damaged or knocked something out of place. When we first got her the tracking was completely out because of this.

Thank you Ian for taking the time to read through this. We're taking her back to the garage on Monday so will mention what you've suggested. My partner is going to try and Jack her up at the weekend to see if there's anything he can see as he's not convinced it's the pump either. Anyone have any pictures of what kinda of things he should be looking out for?

We're going to look at another puma tomorrow morning which has a full service history and looks in pretty good condition just in case we have no joy with my current. However I begrudge getting rid of her considering how much money I've spent on her over the last couple of months. Even one of the guys at the garage was telling my partner not to get rid of her but we'll see how we get on I guess!

 

[Ian G]

Wouldn't even bother inspecting visually, the absence of something obvious doesn't mean that corner is OK, largely a waste of time until its been diag'd properly.

 

[kaylins]

[post]352736[/post] Wouldn't even bother inspecting visually, the absence of something obvious doesn't mean that corner is OK, largely a waste of time until its been diag'd properly.

Unfortunately getting a proper diagnosis is our problem, nothing has been flagging up on any tests which is why it's been so difficult to pinpoint.

My partner has taken a look today just to see how easy it would be to replace the front sensors himself, to hopefully save us some money. After having a look he's quite happy doing it himself and has noticed a few things at the same time. He thinks the encoders look warped. Apparently you can see it brushing against the driver side however couldn't get a good enough view of the passenger side.

He's also discovered I need a new tyre iron and some new bolts as a few are looking a bit worn. There was a bit of rust on the sensor which he's cleaned however he's not going to mess about with the passenger side (which we think is the issue) until we get the tyre iron. So not a complete waste of time!

We're going to replace both front sensors ourselves so if you've got any going spare, we'd love to buy them off you. If not, please give me a shout when you do or if you know somewhere we can get them from for a decent price.

On a plus, we've done 30 miles in her over the weekend and no sign of noise or lights on the dash yet :grin:

I'm glad my partner has had a change of mind about the car and is as determined as I am to solve the problem. He wasn't convinced at first but now he seems to have fallen in love with her almost as much as I have :lol:

 

[Ian G]

The tone wheel should stay a uniform distance from the sensor. With the car in the air but the wheel still on also check for play top to bottom which indicates wear on the wheel bearing which affects the tone wheel position.

I've got loads on the shelf but lets see how that passenger tone wheel looks before you spend any money. Hopefully it'll be wobbly and that's your problem, I was just concerned that if its been through a garage and they couldn't find it then something obvious to see should really have been picked up already.

While you're under there but prior to the job of removing the sensors it might be worth getting some penetrating fluid in there to open things up a bit before you go for the big remove.

 

[kaylins]

Thanks again Ian!

I'm hoping it's what you're suggesting and we don't need to worry about paying any more than we already have. By my partner looking at it, it looks like the garage hasn't even touched the passenger side at all! You can tell they've had the drivers side out as it was all fairly easy to get to and remove but as I said, passenger side - not so much! It looks fairly rusty as well so it could just be the rust coming away and dropping onto the sensors which is why it's so intermittent.

We've got some wire brushes to clean it all up a bit to see if that makes any difference. I'll pass all the info on to the man - hopefully we'll get a chance this weekend if we can get the tyre iron before/by then.

We'll let you know how we get on but thanks again, it's greatly appreciated.

 

[kaylins]

Update:

Since my partner had a look a few weeks back and poked around we have not heard the noise. Whether he's done something or it's sorted itself out we don't know but we've done nearly 150 miles in her since and no sign *touch wood* so far.

The main worry for me was if it happened during my driving test and whether they would fail me for it. I can happily say that she behaved during my test yesterday morning and I passed!!! :grin:

I'd like to thank everyone who has helped with this on going issue and hope it doesn't crop up again however if it does then I know who to go to :wink:

Next step...getting the cambelt changed!