jackos 4x4 project
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jacko
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first measurements look good, not great but still looking good 
top struts for escort are further apart by 40mm AND looks like im going to need 20mm spacers on rear wheels!!
anybody know if this is right; frp is 34mm wider than std puma each side at the rear....20mm spacers and 14mm due to disc assembly being bigger than drum assembly??
reckon i will have to emulate frp setup at the front....re-machine the hub carrier at a new angle for shock to keep camber good
anyone know puma camber / toe in?
top struts for escort are further apart by 40mm AND looks like im going to need 20mm spacers on rear wheels!!
anybody know if this is right; frp is 34mm wider than std puma each side at the rear....20mm spacers and 14mm due to disc assembly being bigger than drum assembly??
reckon i will have to emulate frp setup at the front....re-machine the hub carrier at a new angle for shock to keep camber good
anyone know puma camber / toe in?
yippeekiay
Well-known member
These are for all BUT the FRP.
Castor
Angle = 2.5 degrees Tolerance = 3.75 to 1.25 degrees
Camber
Angle = 0.9 degrees Tolerance = 0.2 to -2.00 degrees
Maximum Variation - left to right-hand side - Castor 1.0 degree, Camber 1.25 degrees
Toe Setting
Setting Adjustment = -2.0mm Toe out to +/- 1.0mm Tolerance = 0.5mm Toe in to -4.5mm Toe out
The 'official' Ford Line is as follows - Units are in Decimal Degrees (*): Front Wheel Alignment Caster : 1.25* to 3.75* Camber : -2.00* to 0.20* Toe: -0.76* Toe Out to 0.08* Toe In or -4.5mm Toe Out to 0.5mm Toe In
Rear Wheel Alignment Camber : -2.00* to -0.50* (unless your Rear Beam is 98FB 5K952 DD, then it's: -2.80* to -1.30*) Toe: 0.13* Toe In to 0.79* Toe In or 1mm Toe In to 5mm Toe In
I shouldn't of wrote any of that as it's probably bloody useless to you...lol.
Castor
Angle = 2.5 degrees Tolerance = 3.75 to 1.25 degrees
Camber
Angle = 0.9 degrees Tolerance = 0.2 to -2.00 degrees
Maximum Variation - left to right-hand side - Castor 1.0 degree, Camber 1.25 degrees
Toe Setting
Setting Adjustment = -2.0mm Toe out to +/- 1.0mm Tolerance = 0.5mm Toe in to -4.5mm Toe out
The 'official' Ford Line is as follows - Units are in Decimal Degrees (*): Front Wheel Alignment Caster : 1.25* to 3.75* Camber : -2.00* to 0.20* Toe: -0.76* Toe Out to 0.08* Toe In or -4.5mm Toe Out to 0.5mm Toe In
Rear Wheel Alignment Camber : -2.00* to -0.50* (unless your Rear Beam is 98FB 5K952 DD, then it's: -2.80* to -1.30*) Toe: 0.13* Toe In to 0.79* Toe In or 1mm Toe In to 5mm Toe In
I shouldn't of wrote any of that as it's probably bloody useless to you...lol.
martinthrapston
Active member
it kept you busy for a while tho whilst you was writing it :-D
yippeekiay
Well-known member
Most was copied and pasted so not too bad...lol.
warrenpenalver
Active member
jacko said:first measurements look good, not great but still looking good
top struts for escort are further apart by 40mm AND looks like im going to need 20mm spacers on rear wheels!!
anybody know if this is right; frp is 34mm wider than std puma each side at the rear....20mm spacers and 14mm due to disc assembly being bigger than drum assembly??
reckon i will have to emulate frp setup at the front....re-machine the hub carrier at a new angle for shock to keep camber good
not sure it would be best way to do it by increasing the shocker angle. you change the forces through the shock and also strain any top mount more.
Your going to be doing welding anyway so why not cut off strut towers and weld them further out or even better fit fully adjustable top mounts. will easily solve 20mm each side then.
Dont forget to measure the hub centre to strut top mount distance and angle on FRP and rs2000. You dont want the geometry to be too out for rear castor and you dont want the hieght messed up by the hub to strut top distance being too different.
jacko
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yep to alignment.
wont be welding much, really dont want to change top mounts, maybe adjustable ones....we'll see
over the length of the shock im hoping the distance needed wont mess with the angle too much...but the shocks will be coilovers eventually and prob custom made so can sort that issue with LEDA etc later
wont be welding much, really dont want to change top mounts, maybe adjustable ones....we'll see
over the length of the shock im hoping the distance needed wont mess with the angle too much...but the shocks will be coilovers eventually and prob custom made so can sort that issue with LEDA etc later
PumaNoob
New member
Man, i wish i had the balls to even think about doing a project like this!!! Should be really good when done!
This is just my opinion, so take with a pinch of salt, but i think that a slight angle on the struts is better, it pushes the force more square through the strut. With a vertical strut, the weight of the car is trying to push outward on a bend, so the wheel has a horizontal force aswel as a vertical force. So a slightly angled strut will put more of that force into the spring/strut, then into the chassis. youd just need some tapered top mounts that allow you to fix square to the strut and wont try and pull it square to the body.
Oh, and just a quick note, the MTX box is about the same legnth, but its taller on the opposite side to the bell housing. I was going to use one on mine, but i didnt want to cut into the chassis legs.
I could be wrong but isnt the transverse version of an MTX75 box not the MT75?
This is just my opinion, so take with a pinch of salt, but i think that a slight angle on the struts is better, it pushes the force more square through the strut. With a vertical strut, the weight of the car is trying to push outward on a bend, so the wheel has a horizontal force aswel as a vertical force. So a slightly angled strut will put more of that force into the spring/strut, then into the chassis. youd just need some tapered top mounts that allow you to fix square to the strut and wont try and pull it square to the body.
Oh, and just a quick note, the MTX box is about the same legnth, but its taller on the opposite side to the bell housing. I was going to use one on mine, but i didnt want to cut into the chassis legs.
I could be wrong but isnt the transverse version of an MTX75 box not the MT75?
jacko
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mtx75 box is transverse, mt75 box is long ways
stripping my spare 4x4 box asap and putting the casing into place to see how it fits but cant do too much else as its an older box so it mounts front and rear not on top
rear cradle is all clean, few parts cleaned, painted and ready to bolt back on and try a dry run....pretty sure everything is gonna need tweeking; its all very similar but 20 or 30mm too big / too small....hey ho, we dont do these things cos there easy!!!!
donor puma is now in 2 halves; engine bay and 'transmission' tunnel and fuel tank & boot floor....
stripping my spare 4x4 box asap and putting the casing into place to see how it fits but cant do too much else as its an older box so it mounts front and rear not on top
rear cradle is all clean, few parts cleaned, painted and ready to bolt back on and try a dry run....pretty sure everything is gonna need tweeking; its all very similar but 20 or 30mm too big / too small....hey ho, we dont do these things cos there easy!!!!
donor puma is now in 2 halves; engine bay and 'transmission' tunnel and fuel tank & boot floor....
PumaNoob
New member
Ive got the 2 boxes mixed up :roll:
PumaNoob
New member
jacko said:stripped the mtx gearbox, easy enough.
4wd gearbox:
Just a quick question, can you strip the IB5 box that way, i mean like just unbolt the bell housing, rather then the way you did it in your 'how to' guide, or does it have to be done like in the guide?
jacko
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you need to take 5th gear off, then its housing, then massive clips on shafts then can split the case....
quick update, will add pics later;
diff is stripped, its not a quaife but has the lube hols machined exactly the same way...as its rare its all machined not cast. looks like i have car no 138 of 500 as its hand stamped on the diff!!
rear cradle and links are loosely in place....need to add 20-30mm to the trailing arms, all bushes will be polybushed or steel inserts and rose jointed, may need wheel spacers approx 15mm per side, still measuring. cradle mounting holes need slotting 20mm or less into centre of car as puma chassis rails are narrower, chop off ends of cradle and weld over again, to fit the whole thing iv had to remove spare wheel mounts and axhaust hangers, itl sit approx 20mm too far forward in chassis but theres flex in bushes to push wheels back enough
using the standard escort shocks and springs, drilled out the puma top mounts and using a nut instead of the circlip, will machine nut thickness off the top mount cover. looks like i need to loose upto 50mm of strut height....will bodge that for now and get some 30-60mm lowering coilovers eventually and lower them 50mm etc to get frp riding level and not like a hot-rod!!!!!
camber......watch this space!!!
quick update, will add pics later;
diff is stripped, its not a quaife but has the lube hols machined exactly the same way...as its rare its all machined not cast. looks like i have car no 138 of 500 as its hand stamped on the diff!!
rear cradle and links are loosely in place....need to add 20-30mm to the trailing arms, all bushes will be polybushed or steel inserts and rose jointed, may need wheel spacers approx 15mm per side, still measuring. cradle mounting holes need slotting 20mm or less into centre of car as puma chassis rails are narrower, chop off ends of cradle and weld over again, to fit the whole thing iv had to remove spare wheel mounts and axhaust hangers, itl sit approx 20mm too far forward in chassis but theres flex in bushes to push wheels back enough
using the standard escort shocks and springs, drilled out the puma top mounts and using a nut instead of the circlip, will machine nut thickness off the top mount cover. looks like i need to loose upto 50mm of strut height....will bodge that for now and get some 30-60mm lowering coilovers eventually and lower them 50mm etc to get frp riding level and not like a hot-rod!!!!!
camber......watch this space!!!
jacko
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diff looks very complicated....
power comes in as normal on the final drive which obviously turns the whole casing....which is extended with a toothed tube into the transfer box....
the transfer box takes ALL the power and splits 60% to rear wheels via a viscous coupling (much like the innerds of a ford lsd) but then it gives back 40% power via a toothed tube which fits INSIDE the diff casings toothed tube and feeds the normal mechanical diff gears.....
which then splits the power to the front wheels via the drive shafts...of which the drivers side runs back through the transfer box....!!!
basically theres the drivers driveshaft running to the diff but before it gets there it runs INSIDE the tube taking power from transfer box to the diff and that tube runs INSIDE the tube taking power from the gearbox to the transfer box!!!!!!
bloody hell!!!!!
power comes in as normal on the final drive which obviously turns the whole casing....which is extended with a toothed tube into the transfer box....
the transfer box takes ALL the power and splits 60% to rear wheels via a viscous coupling (much like the innerds of a ford lsd) but then it gives back 40% power via a toothed tube which fits INSIDE the diff casings toothed tube and feeds the normal mechanical diff gears.....
which then splits the power to the front wheels via the drive shafts...of which the drivers side runs back through the transfer box....!!!
basically theres the drivers driveshaft running to the diff but before it gets there it runs INSIDE the tube taking power from transfer box to the diff and that tube runs INSIDE the tube taking power from the gearbox to the transfer box!!!!!!
bloody hell!!!!!
