What makes an FRP?

[red]

After reading the owners list and seeing that there's more than one FRP where the engine has been removed and sold separately it got me wondering...

Does the car have to have to be whole? If FRP #5 has it's engine removed, sold to a Fiesta and then replaced with a Duratec is it still FRP#5?

How do you keep track of that? since without it's manifold it becomes unidentifiable with no paper work to back up it's history.

This then opens up a gap for replicas, how do you know they are or aren't a replica? Do people care?

 

[bigal82]

very good question, i think it should be based on the original shell as if i had a heart replacement id still be me.

but as you say the shells arent recorded etc so how would you tell.

i doubt even ford ever actually bothered to note all the chassis numbers when they built them.

p.s, i dont care as long as mine still stays as it is ;-).

 

[Dave93.marsh]

It would be nice to find out how many original FRP that are the same as they came out the factory are still about!

I don't think fiestas or standard pumas should make the list to be honest as there not ford racing pumas! The racing puma isnt just the engine with a number stamped on it, it's the whole package!

So maybe we could change the list and move the fiesta's and other alike into a sub section.

I don't want to upset any one who has a fiesta with an FRP engine in as all to there own but just think it would be nice to no exactly how many are left.

Dave #0007

 

[frp292]

well 292 is on,y got a real carbon fibre splitter (apparently not standard) apart from the and the number plate not having a tickford emblem its all original!

 

[Bentleya]

I think it will be nice if we could try really hard to get a list of how many left and if we know the engine is in a Fiesta that helps us as it's one less to account for.

 

[red]

Yeah I think having the one list is fine since all the manifolds in Fiestas are noted as Fiestas, they aren't trying to be something they're not just utilising a part that no one else bought / found.

Anyway, I like your reply Al :grin:

 

[JonB]

With standard Pumas the engine number and end of the chassis number are the same, presumably the FRP is the same. If you have that then you have an original, anything else is either a FRP replica, a modified FRP or in my case a FRP powered car.
The owners list is really a list of numbered manifolds but that is the best we can do with the information available, I guess a true FRP should be as it left the factory, but then does say a non standard exhaust make it a modded one?

 

[yippeekiay]

Purists would say it has to be 100% original, which is fair comment. Me, well if it has an original FRP shell & interior, it's an FRP. If it doesn't it isn't or at best it's a replica.

 

[Flying Scotsman]

I asked the same question at one point as mine is a few parts shy of being the standard of an frp... But I was slated.
So I have to say... No an frp is an frp, bust. You swap the engine, it's a hybrid.

 

[XIIVVX]

... apart from the and the number plate not having a tickford emblem its all original!

As my 996 has the Tickford emblemed plate that #296 used to wear, can it be included please, please, pretty please :derr:

 

[red]

Can't imagine you got slated on here scotsman?

 

[jacko]

what about an frp with a new engine? same cams and inlet etc....but the number wouldnt match the chassis

there is only ONE way to spot a GENUINE frp....the rear arches....and more specifically the inner sections....

NO ONE could get hold of or afford the steel rear arches and no one could be bothered to put the inners on any replicas...not even official pumabuild kits
however....mine are starting to rust so next year im ripping them off and putting fibreglass ones on...i refuse to fix a problem every 3 years so the steel is going!sealant strips on (inside boot) and have factory fitted steel inserts (front of rear arch)

having a replica myself i have fought off the posh frp crowd for years but non of them refute that its a genuine shell as the rear arches are steel, have the factory EVERYTHING else will unbolt. There is also a sticker on the interior of the passenger rear arch which is frp specific and painted imperial blue....or on mine there is a grey patch of primer where its been removed!

tbh tho its a ford, not an aston martin, worrying about it to this degree is a little mental!

 

[red]

I remember reading a similar thread about RS200 so I thought it'd be interesting to hear peoples opinions.

Personally I can see why 'real' ones fetch a premium over ones which weren't converted by Tickford but in all honestly.. there's no difference in terms of ownership if it's used all original parts.

 

[jacko]

but you can't get all the parts!!! so no replica will ever be real

ie the track rods....replicas tend to have the steering travel bodged. frp is 2.7 turns, puma is 2.9

having said that...theres more than enough 'official' bodges on the frp!!! lower arms and strut tops being 2 that come instantly to mind!

 

[melinamotor]

Original condition cars will be the purists definition, trouble is something small like the addition of an alcantara gear gaitor or different tyres could make the difference. Purely subjective subject, 441 was original to me, however the Miltek system and stainless manifold would say otherwise.

 

[jacko]

yeh i don't understand that
if you can get a better / longlasting part minus frp tax then your pretty much clinically insane not to do that! thats my opinion

if it's an aston martin previously owned and raced by 'sir-world-champion-race-driver' etc then fine as its worth more when sold.

i love the frp; its a very special car but i wont spend £130 on a brake disc if i can spend £70 for something just as good.
if i was going a bit mad, maybe id keep a set of oem discs to put on the car when it was sold...

 

[russv]

but you can't get all the parts!!! so no replica will ever be real

ie the track rods....replicas tend to have the steering travel bodged. frp is 2.7 turns, puma is 2.9

having said that...theres more than enough 'official' bodges on the frp!!! lower arms and strut tops being 2 that come instantly to mind!

Ah that will explain why my replica feels strange at full lock and the steering won't self-centre from full lock either (just stays there :/), and going beyond 2.7 turns it pulls the wheel round to full lock by itself. Its not too bad but would rather have 2.7 to lock if it solves it. Can track rods be made fairly cheap? Oo I don't know what they are... xD

Btw, out of interest, whats the problem with the lower arms and strut tops?

Cheers :>

 

[jacko]

the strut tops weren't modified to the new angle of the struts....bit of a bodge really as it compresses the rubber mount at a weird angle

the lower arms were literally cut through with a bandsaw, spaced 35mm apart and a whacking great girder plate welded over the gap with some overlap and seam welded....not a very elegent engineering solution

the track rod is the bit of the steering rack you can see with the wheel off....it unscrews from the rack and uses a track rod end to bolt it to the hub carrier....you can use a focus one as its about 2mm off being a perfect replica....but it needs about a 5mm spacer at the steering rack end to stop the wheel fouling the bodywork / weird steering on full lock...i wouldn't worry about it a great deal as the frp doesnt sound much better than yours at full lock

 

[russv]

Hmm interesting. Thanks for the info Jacko

 

[spike.]

I guess an original FRP is one that went through Tickford.... Original being the key word.

A FRP conversion is one that didn't enter the Tickford factory, but as jacko says no reason that cant be as good, or better than an original tickford one.

An original FRP, could been modified too, but still an FRP.

IMO