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Anonymous
Guest
That would be ok, if mine actually worked in the first place!Pixie said:
yippeekiay
Well-known member
Steve, I only switch it on if the engine has had a good workout or I'm stuck in heavy traffic on a hot day.
Example - was at Nurb, engine was hot and temp gage was rising fast as I was queing to get off the track as I'm sure your aware. Fan hadn't kicked in so I switched it on and the temp gage came straight back down to normal. So that must mean it was at a sufficient point to be circulating. Once I got moving properly I switched it off.
Example 2 - same scenario but in heavy traffic on a hot day - temp gage went up, I switched it on before it came in itself, gage went back down immediately.
Results from my own 'guess work' regarding how hot it is, is that it now never goes above half now as if I think it's getting a tad warm I switch it on before it even thinks about getting too hot.
I think you were confusing what I was saying in that you thought I switched it on when cold or not up to running temp. Give me a bit of credit mate :lol:
Example - was at Nurb, engine was hot and temp gage was rising fast as I was queing to get off the track as I'm sure your aware. Fan hadn't kicked in so I switched it on and the temp gage came straight back down to normal. So that must mean it was at a sufficient point to be circulating. Once I got moving properly I switched it off.
Example 2 - same scenario but in heavy traffic on a hot day - temp gage went up, I switched it on before it came in itself, gage went back down immediately.
Results from my own 'guess work' regarding how hot it is, is that it now never goes above half now as if I think it's getting a tad warm I switch it on before it even thinks about getting too hot.
I think you were confusing what I was saying in that you thought I switched it on when cold or not up to running temp. Give me a bit of credit mate :lol:
ScubaSteve
Active member
- Joined
- May 8, 2010
- Messages
- 3,749
something wrong then, fan should come on before the temp goes over halfway
yippeekiay
Well-known member
It does - but not soon enough for my liking. 
A
Anonymous
Guest
The new temp sensor has not made any difference to the rad fan situation, so I've been doing a little research, and found this information (Yog may recognize!) on the pumapeople site:
QUOTE: 'You are looking about 104/105c for the low speed and 110c for the high speed.'
QUOTE: 'For cars in 99.5 to 00.25 my the engine cooling fan is switched using two relays depending on high or low speed. The two relays controlling this are K45 and K46. These both need two fuses, F28 (15a) and F36 (60a). If either is gone both relays will not work.
K46 feeds directly to the fan for the high speed function (110ish C from the digital dash read out) or it will sometimes kick in and out with the AC on if the lower speed is not working.
K45 also goes to the fan via the resistor pack in your photo. This will kick in approx 104c or all the time when the AC button is lit and compressor functioning. The thermal fuse can blow on this BUT if both speeds are inop I wouldn't do more than just doing a resistance check on it until you get the main fault sorted.'
I've checked the fuses and all are ok and this is confirmed as the fan will work on one speed.
So. If, according to the above information, on AC the rad fan kicks in/out on high speed if the low speed isn't working.
Mine does this so I assume my low speed isn't working... but my question is, 'Why didn't the high speed fan kick in when the temp gauge got that high!?'
I've just ran with the air con on but with the high speed relay pulled out.... no working fan at all. Even pulling the connector off the temp sensor won't kick it in.
I can now deduct the low speed don't work. How would I know if it's the resistor or the relay that's faulty...?
QUOTE: 'You are looking about 104/105c for the low speed and 110c for the high speed.'
QUOTE: 'For cars in 99.5 to 00.25 my the engine cooling fan is switched using two relays depending on high or low speed. The two relays controlling this are K45 and K46. These both need two fuses, F28 (15a) and F36 (60a). If either is gone both relays will not work.
K46 feeds directly to the fan for the high speed function (110ish C from the digital dash read out) or it will sometimes kick in and out with the AC on if the lower speed is not working.
K45 also goes to the fan via the resistor pack in your photo. This will kick in approx 104c or all the time when the AC button is lit and compressor functioning. The thermal fuse can blow on this BUT if both speeds are inop I wouldn't do more than just doing a resistance check on it until you get the main fault sorted.'
I've checked the fuses and all are ok and this is confirmed as the fan will work on one speed.
So. If, according to the above information, on AC the rad fan kicks in/out on high speed if the low speed isn't working.
Mine does this so I assume my low speed isn't working... but my question is, 'Why didn't the high speed fan kick in when the temp gauge got that high!?'
I've just ran with the air con on but with the high speed relay pulled out.... no working fan at all. Even pulling the connector off the temp sensor won't kick it in.
I can now deduct the low speed don't work. How would I know if it's the resistor or the relay that's faulty...?
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Anonymous
Guest
UPDATE TIME:
I got a low speed fan relay and fan resistor from Ian...
Fitted the relay: No improvement
Fitted the fan resistor: Fan now works!!
So, with the air con on, the fan now runs constant low speed instead of high speed (on, off, on off).
Thanks for the parts Ian!
I just now need to monitor the temp level as I sit in traffic... that'll be tomorrow then!
I got a low speed fan relay and fan resistor from Ian...
Fitted the relay: No improvement
Fitted the fan resistor: Fan now works!!
So, with the air con on, the fan now runs constant low speed instead of high speed (on, off, on off).
Thanks for the parts Ian!
I just now need to monitor the temp level as I sit in traffic... that'll be tomorrow then!
quest63
Active member
Where does the fan resistor live?
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Anonymous
Guest
On the bottom right of the fan.... (when looking from the front, above into the engine bay)
My red text hasn't come out as clear as I hoped, but it's still legible.
The wire for the low speed plugs in to the resistor. It's easy to take out.. pull the plug out, undo two phillips screws, resistor pulls out if it hasn't dropped out already.
The high speed comes via the high speed relay...
The low speed comes via the low speed relay, but goes through the resistor. The resistor reduces the voltage to the fan to make low speed.
My red text hasn't come out as clear as I hoped, but it's still legible.
The wire for the low speed plugs in to the resistor. It's easy to take out.. pull the plug out, undo two phillips screws, resistor pulls out if it hasn't dropped out already.
The high speed comes via the high speed relay...
The low speed comes via the low speed relay, but goes through the resistor. The resistor reduces the voltage to the fan to make low speed.
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Anonymous
Guest
This is the resistor:
quest63
Active member
Nice piccie cheers.
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Anonymous
Guest
No probs...quest63 said:
Well, after getting stuck in traffic with the temp gauge creeping up and jumping out to check the fan... the damn thing still won't turn on. Now I'm getting a bit jarred off.
Next idea?
1. Check low speed plug on fan for voltage?
2. Check the plug the relay sits in to see if I get a voltage from the ECU?
3. Continuity test wire from relay to ECU?
4. Kick the crap out of the car, then regret it?
5. Forget about it and bodge in a switch?
Input welcome!
Ginger Tom
New member
Personally, I would go with the switch idea, mainly because I would otherwise do the option above
quest63
Active member
So is the situation the slow speed works,but the high speed doesnt?
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Anonymous
Guest
High speed worked because the low speed didn't.quest63 said:
Low speed now works.
So....
I can force low speed to come on by putting on the air con.
I can force high speed to work if I pull the plug from the coolant temp sensor.
From that, I deduct the ECU can and will trigger either relay to turn on either speed.
But, when coolant temp starts to increase, neither speed comes on. I'm not prepared to let it get even hotter (gauge in the red) to prove whether the high speed works at that temperature.
quest63
Active member
I'm thinking since both fan speeds will work under certain circumstances and since the the sensor has been changed that maybe its time to try an ecu swap as its possible its faulty in regards to sensing and or triggering the fan in the case of the car overheating,but not faulty in regards to the other situations in which it will trigger the fan
In some ways it seems to be a little like Pumanoobs abs problem in as much as he tried all the usual things to solve his abs probs but iirc he had to resort to a replacement ecu.
If that didnt solve the problem then maybe that just leaves a wiring problem between the sensor and the ecu.
In some ways it seems to be a little like Pumanoobs abs problem in as much as he tried all the usual things to solve his abs probs but iirc he had to resort to a replacement ecu.
If that didnt solve the problem then maybe that just leaves a wiring problem between the sensor and the ecu.
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Anonymous
Guest
That certainly does sound possible.
I know that the ECU sends 5 volts to the coolant temp sensor, but whether the ECU gets a return voltage I don't know.
I can check the relays to see if the ECU sends signals to trigger them, but I've read it could cause damage to the ECU.
I really could do with an ECU pinout diagram so I can test continuity on all the wiring....
I know that the ECU sends 5 volts to the coolant temp sensor, but whether the ECU gets a return voltage I don't know.
I can check the relays to see if the ECU sends signals to trigger them, but I've read it could cause damage to the ECU.
I really could do with an ECU pinout diagram so I can test continuity on all the wiring....
Ginger Tom
New member
I can do you a copy of the puma cd I have if that'll help, it does have wiring diagrams on that
YOG
Well-known member
Is this any good?
http://www.turnerautomotive.co.uk/component/content/article/42.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.turnerautomotive.co.uk/component/content/article/42.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Anonymous
Guest
I've got a Ford TIS CD, containing wiring diagrams but nothing about the ECU pinout. I guess the wiring diagrams should tell me something.Ginger Tom said:
That certainly looks useful.YOG said:
I'm wondering if something sinister is going on... I'm pretty sure the cooling fan has never worked when the engine has got hot although I've got it working more than it did....
